the universe, and sex of course

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the universe, and sex of course

In our development branch of the original rules concept I have chosen to display nudity and also depict kissing individuals. I even take it one step further and don’t shy away from showing what could be interpreted as homo- or bisexual acts. Nor will I. Yet one might ponder what actual role sexuality plays in a fantasy universe, what it’s relevance and place is in it, and how this all fits into the universe we develop – one which is inspired by and/or placed within some kind of a Wesnoth setting? That also brings questions like who owns the Wesnoth universe, who has the right to develop it and what is a universe anyway?

Hop along for a somewhat long joyride that will give you something sweet.

what is wesnothian?
The way I envision a Wesnothian universe isn’t necessarily the same as some others may do, be they BfW or WT developers or not. I am not familiar with what seems to at times almost be lexical and precise detailed knowledge of the Wesnoth universe as it is told via the narratives in Battle for Wesnoth and through it’s community and followers.

I myself don’t care if something was historically plausible or if an orc would ever ride a horse or not. I don’t believe it’s wrong or bad to care about such details, and I have a full understanding that they could be both fascinating, entertaining and rewarding in various ways for those that do care and keep them alive. I just don’t think that it’s very viable for a CCG and our target audience, and I would rather let an orc ride a horse even though they usually ride beast-wolves a) if it could make sense in the universe and b) if that would give us a better story with a richer world.

In huge contrast to the very detailed account of the Wesnoth universe it also quite often has huge blanks left there for others to fill given the great openness of the project. This is where I take the shameless liberty to do so. To change, rearrange and break what others might even find already good or even perfect. To slowly evolve it into something that I believe we in WTactics can make greater use of for our own needs in a customizable open source card game in the ways which are laid out for us in the design document.

The universe comes first. It’s huge. While the details in it matter & help shape it, they are usually not a vital aspect of it on their own. More commonly expressed: The whole is greater than the stand alone parts.

tricky but oh so important stuff
What I want you to consider is the product on the one hand, and on the other it’s universe. The relationship isn’t always crystal clear between the two, but they should perhaps best be separated while analysed. Furthermore, a tricky but very important question would be what actually constitutes a universe?

For example, one could visit the world of George Lucas and ask if that world created or lead to the many computer games and comics that take place in it, or if those are just what would have been mediocre products that were branded and thus blessed by the strong and recognizable IP that the Star Wars universe is associated with? Do those products contribute to that universe, or are they just poor images of it that only re-use? Or, is it even true that we don’t contribute to a universe if we only re-mash content and don’t add anything deemed creative by some standard?

Would we reason in a different way if we spoke about any one of the 14 000+ printed titles that somehow relate to Star Wars? If so, how come – does the media matter?

What is a universe anyway? How do we define it? What is its building blocks? Are the fans a vital part of it? Is it the original authors, the copyright holders, the consumers or the hard core and well versed fans that should have creative precedence of how the universe develops? Who has the right to do what and how within a universe?

general definition
Some people try to reduce and simplify this discussion by confusing the notion of a universe with the one known as intellectual property and somehow magically equate the two. Here I will try to avoid writing much about IP:s for now as the discussion would get us astray. For now, let’s just be happy with us making a clear distinction between a person that claims to own something and/or have exclusive rights over it and an individual that somehow builds on ideas sprung from a universe.

In this text a games world, or when put in an even larger context where that game world becomes well developed and somewhat broader – it’s universe – is just the same as a meta-physical framework. It is a set of notions, a gathering of imaginations, of a universe that is most often unlike our own in several regards.

The Star Wars-universe is not equal to all the scripts for the Star Wars movies: It is equal to what can be imagined, plausible, fitting to some extent and what can be in- or deduced from what could be interpreted as being in them. It’s also what can be imagined from a spin off from the spin off. Thus, homo-erotica with Spock and Captain Kirk in slash fiction isn’t very far fetched, no matter what Gene Roddenberry would have thought about it or what his original intentions (if any) with their close friendship was.

workers around the world, unite!
Bart K, one of the steam engines that powers the relatively unknown yet excellent opengameart.org, is asking the question if it wouldn’t “be nice to have some open franchises that people can expand on without fear of being sued?” and adds that “there’s nothing stopping us from doing it.”

He’s of course spot on, and raises an issue that is all too often overlooked by members of the open source communities out there: Why don’t we build common universes more often? How many examples can we even give of works in a shared universe or even a shared smaller setting? More importantly, what obstacles are there that keeps this from happening? And is it worth the work? Would a piece of very good work on its own merit become even better if themed in such a way that it’s is a part of a certain universe?

The technical barrier to achieve global co-work around a universe is long time gone. All that is required is internet and any number or combinations of free solutions like for example Wikimedia, phpBB & Mumble to mention only a few candidates that we happen to use ourself here at WTactics. There are plenty of free and open technologies that can aid and be the corner stone, tool wise, of any conceivable universe.

The lack of open and rich universes is first and foremost a social enigma, as most things human. In part is a tale about creativity and originality – many of the talents found in the open source communities want to create something that’s original, something they can call “our own”.

While that may be a valid reason for why one wouldn’t want to co-work on a universe or place one’s work within that universe, it seems to more often be the repeatable story about human nature: The one that involves ego, control, power and status to name a few ingredients that makes any creative co-work problematic. Coupled off with disorganisation, lack of skills, a clear structure and some kind of working leadership and we would end up explaining a great deal number of failures. Not only related to creation of an open universe, but any project. Worse yet is that all of these aren’t even necessary conditions for a project to fail. It’s often more than enough with just a pinch of a couple of them to make the stew bitter.

our place in the puzzle
I won’t be a liar and offer you my elaborate plan when I began work on WTactics. I had none. There was no grand vision of seeing the Wesnoth universe in various forms of media or even expanding upon that universe. I did however think it was very logical to use parts of the BfW art and whatever in the universe that I happened to believe would serve us well. Logical in a resource kind of way: I perceive most fantasy settings as very much alike and don’t see any point with devising yet another generic universe when there are already tons around.

I am also an avid fan of BfW, having spent countless of hours of work on parts of it’s multiplayer community and think it is an amazing game with a nice setting. I wanted to give back to it by giving it another game, and in addition I also thought that making a card game that was Wesnoth-themed would attract helping hands from the BfW community. It all made sense: Why not use the Wesnoth universe? After all, we were going to create a fantasy game, with many of the visuals from BfW.

In retrospect I don’t think it was a bad choice. Sure, I have had zero help from the BfW community and the lust to create a CCG seems to be nowhere within it, but other than that it was probably on okay decision to stick to the thought that WTactics is set on some other timeline, or even world, in the future of the Wesnoth universe.

While our project goals are not primarily to work towards the expanding and consistency keeping of the Wesnoth universe I believe we will, in one way or the other, become some alternative part of it by eventually offering something interesting that is set within it and can be of use to developers & users of x, where x isn’t necessarily BfW, as it could be virtually anything from a novel to a game of almost any genre.

Even if there will be plenty of historical intertextual references to BfW it is no secret that I with the original rules concept made the conscious decision to use different factions and background stories than the ones found in BfW. Doing so could be considered as a good example of destabilizing a universe, or it might even be seen as not contributing to it all if the differences are too big. I’m willing to take that risk to sport the idea of an ever evolving universe. In time, in characteristics and in where the focus is.

It’s my belief that a good universe is one that can harbour enough width and depth in such a nice package that it is easy to find a use for it and even easier to become engrossed in it. The universe itself is separated from the local domain in the sense that every domain chooses what it will extract and how it will use it. This enables people to create a fork of even a go-cart game, re-theme it into something Wesnothian, and give some of the horse/wolf/bat-races some background story and meaning by picking stuff from the Wesnoth universe, without at the same having to represent the whole Wesnoth universe since that would be excessive and make no sense for the player of WesCart.

sex – our social responsibility
There will surely exist a lot of discrepancies in the future between BfW and WT. Except for different eras, the two domains will feel different due to their settings. The conflicts in WT are supposed to be about stuff that are easy to relate to our own reality in perhaps a more direct way.

Some developers believe that a game or it’s universe can be objective and totally isolated from our real society, both in terms of creating the universe and in understanding it. I am not among them. I find that thought laughable, ridiculous and as an omen about it’s carrier not being acquainted with sociology or even basic psychology. I believe that most games can be interpreted in more or less plausible ways and that we can understand something about their creators when reverse engineering social markers found within their universe. This can certainly be done with games like Battle for Wesnoth, Baldurs Gate or World of Warcraft. As it can with card games like Magic: The gathering.

By the stories or game texts, looking at the art or in some cases even by understanding the rules we can decode something. Let’s call it the beliefs of the developers and/or their message to the audience. Point being, an analysis is usually possible. Should it be done? Is it done? Or are the players happy campers, as clueless as ever, totally unaware of how the mindsets of the developers – consciously or unconsciously – affect their own via the game? And are the developers aware of these ongoing processes? Or are they just victims to the subconscious, reproducing whatever happens to be convention in their society?

As I do not deny that a universe out of this world can be produced I would instead acknowledge and embrace it: WTactics ORC is indeed of this world. It is nowhere near objective or universal. It is a cultural product sprung from the society we live in today, as perceived by it’s developers. While true that we are somewhat diverse (several European countries are represented in the project but also USA) most of us are just “the children of our time” to quote Nationalteatern. We are mostly westeners that are indoctrinated by mainly american pop culture and we have the luxury of having homes, food, internet and whatnot, and even some spare time to work on this great project.

Since every game comes from this world it will usually to some extent also be about this world. It will end up that way whether one as a developer likes it or not, as can be seen by analysing any popular universe, e.g. Star Wars or Lord of the Rings, that are both carbon copies of classical cliche story telling (yet good!) as well as filled with tons of social commentaries that were placed there on purpose or that unknowingly sneaked in without the creators ever noticing it.

Being aware of this can empower creators with greater control of the process and the shape of the end product. I prefer us to be as conscious as possible about it and to use what can’t be avoided anyway – the game as a means of social commentary from certain perspectives. With that in mind, I’d like to add that there has been made an important decision about not using it in a propagandistic way for exclusively one single point of view only. Rather, the original rules concept is to open up the doors for, at times, using it as a social commentary in a way that enables it to serve as inspiration and thought of contemporary issues, no matter if one happens to be a nazi, neo-liberal, socialist, feminist, environmentalist or an animal rights activist, to just mention a few schools of thought (or lack thereof).

Thus, sex is made into a means to comment society. To depict kissing two female elves or two kissing male soldiers is to open up for discussion around the table. Exactly what heading it takes doesn’t matter, as long as it’s there and the topic is raised. The interesting part isn’t if the player is homosexual, homophobic, liberal or conservative him/herself: The main point is the process of the reflection, the thought, and the mentioned discussion.

That is also where nudity fits in: As a feminist myself (yeah, look at me, I don’t find a reason to stay objective and friendly with all – I have no issues people knowing my ideological predisposition and what forces steer my hand when I create. On the contrary, I think transparency is a good thing. Incognito agendas seldom belong in an open source project.) I don’t have a problem with showing bare female breasts in WTactics. Why? Because:

  1. We, and BfW, and a zillion other games, already show naked male breasts without stigmatising or sexualising them. If a person believes that males have the right to show their breasts in society and females don’t have the same right, solely based on the fact that the breasts are attached to a person with a vagina, then such a person is a sexist. Sexism is unjustifiable in the identical way racism is: The racist uses attribute x and claims it to be some kind of relevant factor in his/her ethical consideration for how to treat person y. For example, having black skin colour or being jewish is somehow magically relevant for the average white racist. Problem with racism is that x isn’t rationally relevant. The assumption that x is relevant is false. If x is the colour of your skin or your religion and x is easily recognised as irrelevant by any thinking individual, that same person would also recognise, once it eliminates it’s own cultural trappings and nonsense, that the sex of an individual is simply not a relevant ethical factor in most cases for how we should treat that individual. Yada yada… conclusion: If I choose to hide female breasts only because they were female, then I’d reproduce sexism (yups, in the same manner that most bathhouses around the world reproduce it when they force woman to hide them while bathing in mixed-public but proudly allow the men to show theirs.)
  2. If we should not show female breasts because they’re considered to be sexual I’d challenge that notion: They are maybe so for you, but in vast parts of the world a couple of female breasts are usually not sexualised at all. Why should your society dictate how it should be in the world? In addition, what does it mean that society sexualises them? That we should do as society dictates (hide them) just because it happens to do so, seems to be the conclusion. Such an attitude is equal to idiocy, as it is self-preserving conservative, will hinder the society from developing and also leads to the conclusion that we should accept all kinds of obscure phenomenons like for example unequal salaries among men and women with the very same argument. Bla bla bla… sub. total: What’s sexual or not differs in time and space.
  3. If we should not show female breasts because they could be seen as sexual and that it could offend somebody somewhere then we could might as well just drop dead: Everything from shoes to pee has been sexualised and continues to be so by different (sub)cultures and/or individuals. One one might also wonder why the whole world should adapt to every type of individual that claims they’re deeply offended. In essence: If you are offended by watching something, then please by all means – don’t frakking watch it! Who forces you?
  4. We shouldn’t show nudity if we’re creating a game for children. Oh really? How so? Because you say? Or is the stork still coming? What is the problem with allowing children to see nude people? The reason for why people don’t want that to happen is to learn the children to find the state they were born in and in reality also the state they always reside in – nude by nature, in themselves – as something shameful and strange. It’s good old fashioned indoctrination and brainwashing, teaching the next generation that we must relate to nudity in a awkward way and treat nudity, our own skin and existence, as something problematic and unavoidably associated with sexuality. By making nudity something unnatural and strange we in extension also create what makes nudity sexual in the first place. Bingo-bongo king of Congo: There is no scientific explanation as to why young humans should not see other humans nude, not to mention nude merfolk, orcs or dogs. It’s just social convention. Also, nothing forces you to play with cards that contain nudity – just remove them or, given the open source nature of the project, create some clothes for them. Lastly, we’re not creating a game for kids. We’re creating it for teens and adults.
  5. We shouldn’t depict nudity because it’s associated with sexuality. Answer: Pick any one of the explanation of the above. I’d also be prepared to defend the statement that: Even if it nudity was by necessity associated with sexuality (which it of course isn’t) it still wouldn’t matter since the person delivering the argument then must show that sexuality is something that shouldn’t be mentioned in a society/game and/or that some people shouldn’t be aware of sexuality. Good luck with that.

The list could be made much longer and interesting discussions can surely be had about the topics. To wrap this up for now we can summarise it as follows: If we can create a game that raises questions, will start a discussion or debate, or a string of thought provoking ideas, it’s a good thing. Mission accomplished. We should be happy we accomplished that if we first and foremost also have given the players a good time and solid gameplay, which are the greater priorities for this project.

Contemporary social commentaries will go uncensored with the exception of obvious pornography or exploitation of some other subject matter. An example of the borders drawn here is the showing female breasts: It’s most often enough to show them to kick-start something interesting. There is no need to display a close up of a vagina or penetration. If we would show a that the discussion of it would even be counter-productive as it would likely be about something else.

Sexuality and nudity are just two parts of what are constant contemporary topics in media and society all around us. Those two parts have no special status or place in WTactics. They just happen to be good and easy to follow examples of what a social commentary could deal with. There will be many other topics as well in due time, like for instance our relation to the environment.

I don’t think we have to care if we are considered to be controversial by some. They are likely to be a marginalised group of our potential players and won’t matter much for the playerbase. What I do hope is that we by being daring without being exploitative and provoking without being unbalanced, will end up giving much more to the wider audience that will, when it’s all in place, appreciate that we challenge the stale norms of the commercial game industry and society while at the same time giving people a fun time with a world that they still can relate to and identify with.

I hope this straightens out a couple of things about the sexuality and it’s place in WTactics. If not, have a look & listen, it will surely enchant and give the answers needed. ;)

examples of expanding a universe

  • Organise, structure, delegate, co-work and always have clear goals with extensive documentation of how you work and why.
  • More fiction, high quality novels (collective book writing anyone?)
  • Alternative forms of fiction: Visual novels, interactive fiction, role playing adventures, theatre manuscripts.
  • More systematised and centralised documentation of canon that’s already around, extracted from any medium.

UGU: the universal gaming universe
Here’s one of my old ideas on how you can create a pretty unique online universe:

Theme and interconnect the players so that they are set in one and the same universe while they are playing their favourite type of game genre. Most players have some kind of main interest, like action reflex games (FPS), strategical turn based games (4x), real time strategy (RTS) and simulations (sims) etc. The exact game categories aren’t of interest: The idea that there are several of them and that many can be interconnected is. Actually, that alone is the idea.

There are a million ways to make that idea come true. Here is just one single example written without any at all thought and on the fly to show you what one of the directions it could take might look like:

Imagine for example Battle for Wesnoth’s or OpenCivs classicial in-game view on a massive online map in with somehow timed turns. Whenever a battle between units on the strategic map would occur that would allow other players elsewhere in the world, sitting on different accounts and clients but in same alliances & universe, to battle it out for real in perhaps a RTS. Their armies would somehow correspond to the circumstances of the unit(s) in the BfW strategic view. The outcome of the RTS game would lead to victory or loss in the BfW strategical view. Add to that duels sent from one commander to another leading to people – once again using another client somewhere in the world – picking up arms to fight it out FPS style. Add to that all people that enjoy Sim City building and allow them to play in yet another client where they are developing the cities of already conquered regions.

Key is to make some aspects of every mentioned domain affect some aspects of every other in various ways, and you end up with a game world has more closely connected players with a truer and more social meaning of alliances and, due to the different types of media and domains, also a broader universe with vastly way more depth than anything already around on the market.

Best part is yet to come: All this is doable already! Again, open source projects are around in masses. “All that needs to be done” is to evaluate the code base of each project, re-theme or fork and co-work towards common design goals in a common universe.

 
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Comments (8)

  1. qubodup, April 8, 2012

    I’m glad you’re discussing this topic and are not categorically rejecting sexuality as a topic.

    You should check the laws regarding media rating in your country, and the countries of your hosts.

    By the way: bug? http://i.imgur.com/ly4YM.png Chromium on Linux

    Reply
  • snowdrop, April 8, 2012

    There is no media rating in Sweden, although movies have a “recommended age” (7, 15 or adult) it isn’t legally binding. As for the host I doubt they have issues with us depicting nudity the way we do it, but you’re right that it’s good to know their policy. :)

    Fixed the text-oddity. Thanks for pointing it out: Was my bad when copy & pasting. :P

    Reply
  • Q_x, April 9, 2012

    Just some quick thoughts:

    We need good, playable games. That’s the goal. Doesn’t matter what genre, what size, complexity or time of play. It may be tetris-like stuff themed in funky-on-purpose Star Wars universe, where you manage falling plastic figurines of Luke, Vader, Yoda etc. I don’t mind any theme, from graphs and nodes to contemporary inter-textual riddles – as long as I feel the mesmerism. (If this is the right criteria to judge if the game is good or bad – I don’t care, I just use it.)

    Sad truth is – although there are exceptions (even though I can’t think of any game now that meets my criteria of what should be called post-beta, or gamma) – people just don’t flock around FLOSS projects in any reasonable way – that is including myself, investing two years of sparse work in a project that was declared as unsuccessful by it’s maintainer without any real reason apart from “I don’t have time or energy to continue”. That would be my first thing I’d like to change – helping people to start or select successful projects, as I hope this one would be. Good content here is a factor of great importance, but having a multiverse of graphics, music and designers willing to help (for a price, or for eternal glory, as I do) won’t matter more, than having robust, high-quality engines to choose from (and in general to prepare a remedy for any bottleneck ahead). Is there any engine mature enough to leave beta stage, yet the resulting games not looking like it’s from the late 90-s? I don’t think I’ve seen any – though I might have overlooked something lately (I haven’t yet seen GemRB in action, but I’ve seen Bioware specs – I think without a set of developer’s editors it’s not a full-blown engine, just an emulator). Niche exceptions are RenPy and at least two IF solutions. Still – very, veeery niche.

    So ok, let’s assume we’re having those universes, what we can achieve? Burn out as many coders, as we can? Leave army of bitter game designers? Will it make things any better? Will there be any good games? I doubt so. I hope you’ve got the point

    Also – significant amount of the images we use is based on GPL license – that is what rules in Wesnoth. No commercial project will push any money into GPLed universe of this kind – we can rely either on our private money, or on our sole hands.

    That’s a punch in the balls, but I haven’t any playable FLOSS game yet, that would benefit from having a ready-made universe of various artwork. Whole model doesn’t seem to work for such type of products. I haven’t seen any big FLOSS game that doesn’t crash every now and then, or runs slow as hell, either one of those is quite frustrating. I think we won’t be affected by code issues in a cardgame though.

    As for nudity “and stuff” – we’re 15+ project right from the start, rather not happy, family-friendly stuff. Brutality, hedonism, exploiting weaknesses – those are values that rule both game and players worlds, I see no gap, nor problem here – I can se us developing the game in a way that shows even more connections between game world and reasoning behind some strategies that players may develop.

    Reply
  • Q_x, April 9, 2012

    ^^ Sumtin ate my newlines :(

    Reply
  • snowdrop, April 9, 2012

    ) Sad truth is – although there are exceptions (even though I can’t think of any game now that meets my criteria of what should be called post-beta, or gamma)

    Teeworld, FreeCiv, Wesnoth, Flightgear, Nexuiz, PokerTH, Supertuxcart, Frets On Fire, Stepmania… I’d say all of them are “completed” games, in some cases even equal or surpassing their commercial counterparts. There are more, but you are right that the list isn’t at all very logn considered amoutn of projects and people…

    Would be cool to do a more serious research of this and write up the results…

    “k in a project that was declared as unsuccessful by it’s maintainer without any real reason apart from “I don’t have time or energy to continue”.”

    Well, isn’t that as good reason as any? ;) I mean, especially if it’s unpaid work and hobby project, then I honestly don’t think he/she should continue if the person feels like that. I can take myself as an example: I have done zero on WT some months depending on my own personal state.

    What sounds strange though is if that is a reason
    to declare a project dead. Project is dead when nobody works on it and it drifts or disappears from the net. Then it’s more or less cold.

    “yet the resulting games not looking like it’s from the late 90-s? I don’t think I’ve seen any “

    Lack of team members with skills will lead to that. Most often it’s the artists that are lacking, or funding to buy the art. Even if art is there something else could be lacking, for instance the knowledge to build a good GUI for the player, music, script writers and so on.

    Never underestimate how many skilled people it takes to build a solid game. I don’t think the majority of the FLOSS world realizes this until it’s too late. And, as you wrote, something magical must happen for all these people to flock, for free.

    (Here you have an interesting thought as well, the FLOSS-toss-paradox:

    1. Those most skilled, motivated and likely to partake in a floss-project is also the ones that are either just starting their careers or closing on the end of the first 1/3 of them. They’d generally be about 20 to 35 (max) years old. Somewhere there is also the age many will want to get a partner, settle down, move and eventually having kids (and later on tossing baseball with it), taking care of family and trying to make a living by getting a career.

    2. People that “only” invest time and consider something as a hobby project are more likely to toss it out of the window for whatever reason when there is some kind of real or imagined contradiction or conflict with working on that project and something else in life. )

    . So ok, let’s assume we’re having those universes, what we can achieve?

    My suggestion is that the floss world needs 1 to 3 strong universes. To not make things further complicated, let’s just assume that a universe is “the world and it’s surrounding, inhabitants, society and physics where the game events all happen”.

    For example, Star Wars or Lord of the Rings are two very good examples of universes. We know something about not just the characters, but much of the worlds they move in, how the big picture looks like, and the place of it all.

    You ask what would become better by FLOSS having a (libre) universe. The answer is that it, in itself, doesn’t enchant technology or add resources. People don’t become magically better coders because they work on “Open Uni” instead of project x.

    The benefit would be that a universe works as a kind of branding. A coherent universe with just 2-3 games in it in different genres will give an impression of something that is massive, paramount, engaging, global and a collaborative effort. In addition, it will give the impression of solidity and being stable: You will know that this world that you want to play in or code for, it won’t fade away because one sub-project pooped it pants.

    Part of that stability comes from another paradox – it being fluid and constantly worked upon: All three games could for example still share same lore archive, and organize the author teams, and so on. Stability is there because we know it won’t stagnate and then slowly die away as it isn’t renewed. (Commercial/closed universes have the tendency to die as soon as it’s publishers find it is selling too poor… then if the universe is lucky there will be some fan-fiction, which is often illegal and also dies away within a couple of years if the franchise isn’t rebooted a la Star Trek / Wars…)

    Thus, my suggestion about uniting to create an Open Uni isn’t one about coders necessarily working cross-projects (honestly, not many would benefit from that or have the time anyways) like for example “the free game alliance” claim that they do. It isn’t necessarily about sharing 3d-models and trying to fit them all in different games.

    It is about sharing lore, world maps, key characters/factions, interests/conflicts. There could be a lore-central and also a beastiary/character central with concept art etc etc, for example. A wiki and galleries, that define the universe, and where all the content is libre. That would be the most basic start I think, and also the most natural.

    If coders then eventually decide to bridge their projects (for example, the team that coded an RTS works with an FPS team and now whatever happens in one clan in one of the games affects the clan members in the others as well) it would be cool and FLOSS history, and also easier since they already share universe. However, my main point with an Open Uni isn’t this game-bridging (even if I think it would be nice and truly expand the meaning of multiplayer since it adds cross-genre). It is the uni itself and it’s supposed attraction.

    I believe projects that were connected to such a uni would have an easier time finding both resources and people. That is not to say that they will rain down on them from the sky. But easier time? Sure, I think so. I also think different projects within the universe will have slightly more easier time to find players due to synergy-effects and gained exposure.

    I’m guessing now, but judging from the industry it seems to often be the case, and I see no reasons against it.

    Wesnoth. No commercial project will push any money into GPLed universe of this kind – we can rely either on our private money, or on our sole hands.

    I agree that most companies would not push money into GPLd projects, yet, GPL-projects can have a great success if handled properly and if the product/services are solid. Red Hat just made 1 BILLION dollar revenue, and they’re mostly floss. Sure, diff sector and all, but there are numerous other examples, albeit not in the gaming world.

    Problem isn’t that it’s all about games. Problem is that this far companies have lacked reasons to invest in GPL’d games. (Then again, we hve the Nexuiz controversy, ring a bell? ; ) If you make something that is good enough then people will play it and pay for it. So what if it’s GPL?

    It doesn’t mean that people can/will setup as good servers and offer as good services as you will, as the developer of it. You are always one step ahead as dev, unless of course, people fork you and make something better, but even in that case the world benefits even more from it then.

    My point here is that a) you can always relicense, if you have small enough crew if that is the issue and funding is needed and b) you can become the company yourself instead of waiting for sunshine.

    ” haven’t any playable FLOSS game yet, that would benefit from having a ready-made universe of various artwork. “

    My idea is not for that game to necessarily use the ready work in-game as-is, but to use it as concept art to get an idea for how the creatures/world(s) look like. If there happens to be rigged blend-files waiting and they fit right into a game then by all means, why not, but that kind of pre-fabricated assets isn’t the primary purpose with a Open uni. :P

    Reply
  • snowdrop, April 9, 2012

    Great… this GPL theme *har har* doesn’t seem to input the linebreaks… will have to contact them about that, refuse to believe it’s acceptable when I paid 79 bucks for it….

    Reply
  • Q_x, April 10, 2012

    We might get lucky moving a part of this convo into the forum of some kind – doesn’t matter if here, on OGA or freegamer.

    But, back to the games. As for all the titles you have mentioned – I’ve actually played only a minor part of it, but I’d add Warsow (if it’s free). Supertuxcart I’ve seen in March, but I believe the packaging was broken, as I couldn’t see anything – the game looked like blended, baked and blended again. Teeworlds is in beta. Wesnoth I love, but it crashed way to often to really enjoy it, certainly not shop-shelf quality – I doubt it’s the fault of wesnothian coders, however crashes lowers the experience below expectations. The rest I haven’t seen – mesmerism factor turns low in my case on those genres – and in case of free remakes, I’d rather play the original.

    Still – we have some games, not dev-ready engines – at least I’ve seen none. Frogatto may be an exception, but there’s no other I know of.

    As for what’s the universe. First answer is – it’s what people make it. Second answer is – it’s not only content, but also some ways of binding it together, creating narration and overall quality people refer to as ‘mood’. For a simplistic example – you can have the same spiderman character used in comic-book like game, and you can have it as a wallpaper in a racing game or in a pinball, themed in “kid room” way, along with a slingshot and Michael Jackson poster. But it’s much more in-depth matter. Of course if a game designer happens to be sensible enough.

    Please don’t give Red Hat as an example here. No commercial games means no games, putting together enterprise business solutions for years is quite a different story – so is or was Sun, IBM, Oracle or Google. Opening Minecraft may be a good example – I think Notch would still make money on it, and people would be able to start coding their own servers and clients, make own worlds, items and rules, yet the original place would still be quite crowded. Universe example may be making a puzzle game where you have to craft raw stuff down to a given volume.

    Finally, not having time or energy is a perfect reason to cease any project, I’m not trying to judge or value reasons here, more trying to show why projects fail and what reasons are behind starting and ceasing those. Growing up of the leader and starting a family – is just an example we both have used and is quite common in reality. Comes down to people not being honest and serious right from start – what I can add is that Martin, the person I was talking about, actually cared – and still cares about the project and he was as honest as one can be.

    Still, I see only as much benefit of having universes, or even less, than when having good engine by hand (among other tools) – such that works, doesn’t crash, has all the bells and whistles one may want to activate and requires little coding to make a first demo. Making universes – crowding people, making them work, be ready for more work and so on – is only reasonable when there would be any successful projects using it in the end. A project like that requires much more – I mean “much much”, not mere “much”. Starting with right attitude, helpfull tutorials about game development, tutorials about software development, tutorials about making successful FLOSS projects, through free hosting space without any foolish limitations of code space or members count, to platforms for sharing the fruits – actual games. With all the buzz, audience and so on. It comes down to the real goal: making people focus on actual game design, rather than trying to overcome endless software (and community) malfunctions. To bring back the example: I wasted a month to do a simple thing in case of Scribus, and haven’t really recovered my mana after the trauma of experiencing how this community rolls.

    Reply
  • aspidites, April 14, 2012

    Just seeing if new lines of another type work….
    Yes?
    No?

    Reply
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